Religious right fears marriage win

Religious right fears marriage win

Changes to Labor policy have backed the religious right into a fighting corner as they escalate their campaign to deny same-sex relationship recognition.
As same-sex marriage advocates ramp up their push for submissions to the marriage inquiry, so too are the religious right, in a race to tip the scale of numbers before the August 28 deadline.
The Salt Shakers have admitted feeling a little shaken, following the inclusion of some allowances at the recent Labor Party conference.
Despite the spin of Labor and some Christian commentators to try and put a positive note on the conference outcome regarding marriage, things are not as good as one might think, the group’s website reads.  It laments the changes to Labor Party policy documents which removed statements about marriage being between a man and a woman and about forms of relationship recognition which mimic marriage. Policy documents also spoke of a national framework for relationship recognition.
Naturally the lie perpetuated by the Labor policy is that all discrimination is wrong, when it is not. It is right to discriminate against those things that are unnatural and immoral, the Salt Shakers responded.
All in all, this Labor conference has moved the nation closer to the day when unnatural same-sex marriage becomes a reality.
The Salt Shakers’ objection to marriage -” or any other form of same-sex relationship recognition -” is not simply a religious matter, according to co-founder Peter Stokes.
It’s much, much more than that. It’s a question of the relationships themselves -” whether society should be normalising and then accepting those relationships and legitimising them under any form of legal recognition, he told Sydney Star Observer.
I’m concerned that [the Labor Party] are normalising same-sex relationships. We believe the conference took another step towards the ALP inevitability of normalising same-sex relationships, even through marriage. Their justification for saying they don’t agree with marriage has been very weak and frankly, so have some religious groups’ reasons for accepting relationship registers.
You can’t have it both ways and say these relationships are normal and need equal rights or benefits but then say it can only go so far. Our position is that, if you’re going to give them relationship registers, why not give them marriage?

info: To write your submission visit Australian Marriage Equality’s website at
www.australianmarriageequality.com

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33 responses to “Religious right fears marriage win”

  1. You see people Peter S and the Salt Shakers do not want the truth. They cannot handle it. They are not after evidence. They have spent years obsessed about homosexuals and hating them. Why else would they call us Child Sex Offenders in government submissions. Peter has apologized about this. But the damage is done. He has no credibility now.

    As others here have said, they do not campaign against rapist and murderers. They choose to target people like us. In there perverted mind we are worse then these rapist and murderers I guess.

    They are a cult. Only Peter S knows the way. Only he can understand Jesus. Follow him….. Sound familiar? Cults are often run by a husband and wife.

    Peter should go look up what a cult is. He might not be aware of the monster he has become. He does not do things in the name of Jesus. Only to satisfy his narcissistic appetite.

    Look out for him when he goes on forums. Remind people about the former British Bus drive who now runs a cult with his family. Copy and paste my text about the bible above. Peter will often quote the Bible, as he has done here, then when challenged he no longer talks about it. He uses words like abnormal etc. He has no other arguments. He will talk about the lack of science and “don’t hold your breath” etc.

    Look out for the Salt Shakers as they write to ABC forums, news forums, and ring up radio. They have a good guide on there website on how to make submissions etc. I think I will borrow it for my new website. Use it to make your own submissions.

    I think this cult will die with the all wise and knowing Peter S. But in the meantime we must think about the hurtful comments he makes and youth suicide.

    Nature has a good way of taking Peter S from the world. It renews humanity. We do not live forever. Peter S is approaching the end of his life. Hell will be upon him and not us.

  2. Peter S forgive us for thinking your a twit. Perhaps it was the submissions to government saying we are like child sex offenders, perhaps it was you pretending to understand any of the Bible and actually quoting it to us, perhaps you need help. Scientifically there is no cure for narcissism, just homophobia. You are just so offensive to us with your vile mouth. Your behavior is not normal. It goes against the Bible. It makes me sick to think about the things you do. What sort of role model are you? Any of this language sound familiar? You use it all the time against us.

    Your are approaching the end of your life. What will you leave behind? I think know one will remember you and your nasty little group. Australian History is littered with small cults know one remembers.

    I have read the stuff you write about us on the web. You are obsessed about homosexuals. Not sure why? You go to more gay sites then I do. You write much more about homosexuals then I do.

    Tell us your address. I would love to buy a house next door to you. You would see my partner and I gardening, shopping and doing all the boring old things in life that every one does. Oh, and going to Church like you.

  3. Peter S forgive us for thinking your a twit. Perhaps it was the submissions to government saying we are like child sex offenders, perhaps it was you pretending to understand any of the Bible and actually quoting it to us, perhaps you need help. Scientifically there is no cure for narcissism, just homophobia. You are just so offensive to us with your vile mouth. Your behavior is not normal. It goes against the Bible. It makes me sick to think about the things you do. What sort of role model are you? Any of this language sound familiar? You use it all the time against us.

    Your are approaching the end of your life. What will you leave behind? I think know one will remember you and your nasty little group. Australian History is lettered with small cults know one remembers.

    I have read the stuff you write about us on the web. You are obsessed about homosexuals. Not sure why? You go to more gay sites then I do. You write much more about homosexuals then I do.

    Tell us your address. I would love to buy a house next door to you. You would see my partner and I gardening, shopping and doing all the boring old things in life that every one does. Oh, and going to Church like you.

  4. Peter- if your organisation opposes same-sex marriage because you think it’s bad for children, please explain why you have never campaigned for a ban on heterosexual rapists and murderers marrying? What exactly is it that a heterosexual murderer or rapist can provide for a child that a loving and committed same-sex couple cannot? Please don’t tell me it’s a gender role model. Why do heterosexual murderers and rapists deserve a second chance, when apparently loving and law abiding same-sex couples do not even deserve a first chance?

  5. Oh Please….

    Peter S you are such a Happy Clapper Loopy person. The wall is white but you say it is black. I am sorry Peter. The world is not flat. It is round. Yes there are thousands of studies on us. But you lack the intellect to look at them or understand them. You resort to petty arguments you cannot back up by evidence from that dreadful word you hate, science!

    You can go read a History of Homophobia in Australia. Further you can contact The Australian New Zealand college of Psychiatry for further reading on the studies and subscribe to some scientific journals. In fact you should go get help yourself as homophobia is a phobia. We do not have a clinical problem, you actually do.

    We have been cut up, and studied every which way. You know that Peter. Even the Nazis killed over 15000 of us. Many had experiments on them. From few survivors we were treated worse then the Jews. What about the shock treatment in the 60’s? I guess that did not happen. What about parts of our brains being cut out? I guess that did not happen either.

    To take the claims made against families with same-sex couples as an example, a systematic review of 38 empirical studies published between 1978 and 2000, on 615 children raised by same-sex couples compared with 387 other children in Europe and North America, found no difference between the two groups in emotional functioning, sexual preference, stigmatisation, gender role behaviour, behavioural adjustment, gender identity or cognitive function (Scandinavian Journal of Psychology 2002). This is not to mention the great studies since then. You are still calling the white wall black Peter.

    Further what is your stupid obsession about Ex Gays? There are some in the heterosexual community and the gay community who are bisexual. Get over it. Know one cares? You and your twenty or so members (Less excluding family).

    You need help Peter S. We are not qualified to help you with homophobia. This is not the right place for you.

    Here you are writing on gay forums for what? Your group will be remembered as a nutty Hate Group after your passing. Do something constructive about your homophobia and get help.

    I think we should not bother with Peter as he does have what appears to be a treatable phobia.

    Such a narcissistic person to come here and insult us starting off by quoting the Bible. Go get help Peter or find some insect to torture. The Salt Shakers are a voice in there own mind only. Go google yourself.

  6. Yes, Thankyou David.

    Dear Peter S, Your organisation and the other Christian sects are warning society about the inherent dangers of homosexuality, alcohol consumption and gambling.

    What warning does your organisation and the other Christian sects give society about incest?

  7. Dear David S, Your organisation and the other Christian sects are warning society about the inherent dangers of homosexuality, alcohol consumption and gambling.

    What warning does your organisation and the other Christian sects give society about incest?

  8. Andrew, if homosexuals were not obsessed with normalising their behaviour I would never have to mention it. We respond to a whole range of issues that are being ‘promoted’ as good, when the evidence clearly shows they are detrimental to society. These include the abuse of alcohol which Christians have campaigned against for years and called WOWSERS for their efforts. Take a look around the streets of Melbourne today and see the damage it is causing, especially when combined with overt displays of gratuitous sex. Even the AFL club captains and now calling for restraint – try calling them wowsers.
    Sadly, the selfishness of individuals and society generally means it is often only after the horse has bolted that they try to shut the door.
    Salt Shakers and many other Christian groups also warned the government about the dangers of poker machines, but once again the horse bolted and now they can’t even find the door to shut.
    While you and others promote that which is unnatural, despite the self justification Dave uses above to suggest otherwise, we will continue to be a voice of warning, a voice for common sense, and one day, when society finally wakes up as other societies have done in the past, we will, in all good conscience, be able to say we tried to warn you and you did not listen.
    It is easy to make inflammatory statements about “thousands of studies”, Dave, but substantiating that under proper scrutiny is much more difficult – I invite you to send me even a small sample.
    As for children, the only studies showing “no difference’ are compiled by homosexuals and are either very narrow in there research focus or they deliberately ignore a much wider body of unbiased research. Once again I invite you to send me a small sample you think proves your point.
    I won’t hold my breath on either issue, Dave, as I know real evidence is something the homosexual community is very short of, hence the constant exaggerations.
    As for the biology comment, Dave, that was a joke, wasn’t it -“ you simply can’t be that naive!!

  9. Dan Savage, who writes for US gay magazines, made an interesting point about so-called ex-gays. He asked religious zealots “would you like your sister to marry one?” I don’t think too many straights would like to get into a relationship with someone who claims they were once gay but have now changed their ways. I know from volunteer phone counselling the utter misery which happens when spouses find out their other half prefers a same-sex relationship. However, for the Saltshakers, a miserable, dysfunctional marriage between a straight and a gay person is so much better than a happy same-sex couple.

  10. My partner is a medical doctor and could not stop laughing at the Salt Shakers hate and stupidity. We are very natural. Biologically we are designed for this. The majority of Australians are against the Salt Shakers and want legal recognition of our relationship. All twenty or so members of the Salt Shakers are in the minority.

    Salt Shakers do not own Marriage. It has happened long before they walked the Earth, and will happen long after they die out. Next thing Salt Shakers will be arguing the world is flat.

    Gay Marriage has happened for thousands of years. Many cultures around the world celebrate the relationship two people of the same sex have. Many good Christian Churches do to.

    The Salt Shakers lost the religious argument with academics, and the thousands of studies on us have proved we are natural and normal. Even Peer review studies on our children show no difference then that of heterosexual couples.

    The facts are the Salt Shakers are homophobic. If they are reading this they should look it up. It is must be a strange world for them where every one else is not normal expect for them. Only they know what is Good and what is Evil. Sounds more and more like a cult to me.

    My partner and I attend our local Baptist Church each week and are much loved by many in the congregation. Perhaps the Salt Shakers need to give out a bit love instead of the constant homophobia. In the end this is what they will be there legacy. Not good Christians.

  11. Peter- “Our name, Eliska, comes from the Bible -“ Matthew 5 states Christians are to be -œsalt and light, and, as Andrew should know having contacted us directly, it has nothing to do with Lot’s wife.”

    My apologies Peter, I’d always assumed that was the case- perhaps it was your tireless obsession with sodomy that lead me to that conclusion? ‘Salt in the wound’ would be more appropriate.

    Peter- “Homosexuality is not an innate characteristic so it cannot be compared to colour or ethnic discrimination which was [sic] always condemned in the Bible and should be in society. I know a number of people who thought it was, but who are now in heterosexual relationships.”

    Homosexuals hiding in heterosexual relationships are nothing new- this is called being in the closet. I have never heard of a so-called “Ex Gay” who did not admit to ongoing struggles with their same-sex attraction. If they were really straight they wouldn’t have such a battle.

    There are few passages in the Bible that can be interpreted as promoting the equality of the races, and many others that have been interpreted in the past as racist, and continue to be lent on by White Supremacist Christian groups in justifying their bigotry. In the old Testament both God himself and his followers commit genocide on a number of occasions. I notice you don’t mention gender discrimination here, as we all know the Bible treats women like dirt.

    “Aristotle said, -œThe worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal. That is what the homosexual lobby does when it suggests an unnatural sexual orientation is normal, and equal to, male/female relationships.”

    Again, speaking of Christians treating things unequally- reminds me of when European Christians used the story of the Curse of Ham in Genesis to back up their bigoted view that black people were made inferior, and were thus appropriate for enslavement.

  12. Hi David
    We have never said Christianity is innate or that we should be given special rights. In fact we oppose anti discrimination exemptions for religion because that is a selfish position to take. Sadly many in the church are more concerned for their own freedom than that of the community in general – bad laws affect all people and should be opposed outright.
    Paul, despite your rudeness I have replied personally to your email to me without any hate. I suggested you look at the facts of biology and anatomy to understand what is natural or unnatural.
    I agree with you that who people sleep with is their own choice, BUT it ceases to be private when you expect other people to not only condone or agree with but also legalise and register your choices.
    That decision, to normalise any change in social structure, should be tested by sound research and open and vigorous debate. Insisting on some nebulous idea of ‘human rights’ for something that is so clearly against human nature is simply absurd.

  13. Dear Peter S, I also know a number of people who lived as heterosexuals all their lives as part of a married couple and who bore and raised children.

    Then, because of the decriminalisation of homosexuality and the decision by medical scientists to remove homosexuality from the list of psychological and psychiatric illnesses, changed, and began living as homosexuals.

    The bible has always proscribed certain actions and has prescribed penalties for those proscribed actions.

    The penalty for homosexual behaviour is the same penalty for adultery but for some reason the religious organisations treat homosexuality as a more serious offence than the offence of adultery.

    Why do you regard homosexuality as a more serious offence than the offence of adultery?

  14. The Salt Shakers are just a hate group with a poor understanding of the Bible. They view all who do not follow there view of the world as Evil. This includes Buddhist and Muslims. They fail to understand not every Christian follows such hate and stupid interpretations of the Bible. The Salt Shakers are going to Hell for this I and many others feel. Make no mistake. They have demonstrated pure Evil saying we are child sex offenders, and we are a cancer.

    Peter Stokes, former British immigrant bus driver is the head of them. He vilifies many who are gay. Even our Olympic Diver copped it.

    All the hate groups of Australia could muster up against us is the pathetic showing of a few hundred people in Parliament house to celebrate John Howards changes to the Marriage Act. Even he would not go. He got the votes of the nutters and fled!

    Our loopy Happy Clapper PM Kevin Rudd did not go. In fact only the former Governor General did. He donated thousands to the Australian Family Association and is now Married Couple of the Year. Oh what a surprise corruption in the Hate groups?

    Well Salt Shakers thousands protested around the country in support of Gay Marriage. You and your ilk could only muster a couple of hundred people.

    You cannot win an argument about the Bible and what the translation say. You have lost just as others who hated aboriginals lost.

    The Bible also says clearly that sex with a prostitute is acceptable for the husband but not for the wife. Polygamy (more than one wife) is acceptable, as is a king’s having many concubines. (Solomon, the wisest king of all, had 1,000 concubines.) Slavery and sex with slaves, marriage of girls aged 11-13, and treatment of women as property are all accepted practices in the Scriptures. On the other hand, there are strict prohibitions against interracial marriage, birth control, discussing or even naming a sexual organ, and seeing one’s parents nude.

    DEUTERONOMY 22:13-21
    If it is discovered that a bride is not a virgin, the Bible demands that she be executed by stoning immediately.

    MARK 12:18-27
    If a man dies childless, his widow is ordered by biblical law to have intercourse with each of his brothers in turn until she bears her deceased husband a male heir.

    LEVITICUS 18:19
    The Bible forbids a married couple from having sexual intercourse during a woman’s period. If they disobey, both shall be executed.

    Interesting how the Salt Shakers only want to use certain parts of the Bible while ignoring others.

    Peter you really have no leg to stand on. That is why the Uniting Church accepts us, along with almost half the Anglicans, The Luthren Church in the States, and many more. Many Bishops are saying these times will be remembered by hateful people who held power. We will all say how could people like you of been so Evil.

    If you look at the Bible carefully you can use it to justify anything you want. So do not come here pretending you are some sort of expert insulting us with your poor translations, and your baggage about gay people. You can go back to Hell as far as our community is concerned.

    How dare you use the name of Jesus for hate Mr Stokes. Such pure bloody Evil.

  15. Am I psychic or what?

    I notice Stoke’s tries to make the case that homosexuality is supposedly not an innate characteristic, it is unnatural (yawn) and should be condemned. I have news for Stokes. Christianity is unnatural if you mean that nobody is born a Christian in the way people are born male or female. The same goes for any religion. By Stokes’ own criteria, his own sect could be persecuted. Talk about being hoisted on one’s own petard!

  16. Peter S, despite your stupid, hateful and offensive views, gays & lesbians will continue to exist, form relationships and get on with life. Note that by far most gay & lesbian people are the result of heterosexula relationships. In the scheme of things, at best you and your comments are an irritant. We will not shut up whilst people like you continue to spew your propoganda. As far as I am concerned, who the next person chooses to fuck has nothing to do with me or you or life in general, unless you are the subject of the affection. If you cannot understand and life with that reality of life, then shut up and piss off.

  17. I went to the Saltshaker’s website and found a link to two reports by the Australian Institute of Health and Welfare.

    Those two reports dealt with child protection matters.

    The 2005-2006 report shows that over 28,000 children were victims of abuse and neglect in NSW.

    In the 2007-2008 report the number had risen to over 34,000 children.

    I did a search of both reports for the word ‘incest’ and got zero results.

    What that means is that there has been an organised effort by political parties and religious organisations to eliminate the act of incest as a discrete act which has its own set of causal factors and effects.

    The effort to conceal the extent and prevalence of incest by political parties and religious organisations has succeeded because the government departments tasked with reporting child sexual abuse do not include incest in their reports as a discrete act so that people reading those reports could assess the extent and prevalence of incest in NSW.

    Political parties and religious organisations vigorously attack the efforts of the Gay community to have same sex marriage legalised.

    In response to that attack I recommend that the Gay community campaign to have incest recognised as a discrete act that should be included in statistics related to child abuse in government reports.

  18. Hi folks,
    Just wanted to clarify a few of small points.
    Firstly, we do not “fear” a same-sex marriage win – we are deeply concerned about the normalisation of something that is unnatural.
    Secondly, we don’t feel “shaken” because we were expecting some further capitulation by the gutless ALP.

    Our name, Eliska, comes from the Bible – Matthew 5 states Christians are to be “salt and light”, and, as Andrew should know having contacted us directly, it has nothing to do with Lot’s wife.
    Homosexuality is not an innate characteristic so it cannot be compared to colour or ethnic discrimination which was always condemned in the Bible and should be in society.
    I know a number of people who thought it was, but who are now in heterosexual relationships.
    Aristotle said, “The worst form of inequality is to try to make unequal things equal”.
    That is what the homosexual lobby does when it suggests an unnatural sexual orientation is normal, and equal to, male/female relationships.

  19. What is unnatural is the sick obsession the Saltshakers and other so-called religious sects have concerning the intimate lives of gay men and lesbians. Peter Stokes from the Saltshakers sometimes posts on this website. Makes you wonder what other gay websites he trolls.

    At any rate, the political aims of the religious fanatics are out of line in democracies. Unfortunately for them, democratic societies have a tendency to confer more and more rights on gay people as time goes by. This is why the issue of same-sex marriage is making progress in Australia rather than North Korea or Saudi Arabia.

    Soon the Saltshakers, Christian Democrats and their brothers in bile will have to make a choice: to remain living in a democratic country or move to an anti-gay but authoritarian regime.

  20. My guess is that it’s a reference to Lot’s wife being turned into a pillar of salt in the story of Sodom and Gommorah.

  21. I am so sick of religious twats . I am a straight woman and I will never understand why people are so bloody hateful . You are born gay , sexuality is just a part of being human . Shame on the Australian Government for being such evil closeminded sheep.

  22. whats what rights gay people have effect them anyway? i mean just look at all the stories of catholic priests and small boys….i am over contridiction in religeon and law…..it is time it is corrected and people stop saying one thing and doing another.

  23. saying we cant get married coz we are gay is like saying that people of different cultural backgrounds can not marry. they didnt get to choose their culture and we didnt get to choose to be gay nor did the straight choose to be straight. and if religion is a large factor.. who created us all according to the bible?? ‘god’ and i mean call me crazy but i went to a catholic school preschool- year 12 and they aways said that ‘god made everyone the way they are’ and ‘we are all god’s children’ and ‘god will alway love you no matter what’ so who is a bunch of hypocrits now??? let us get married already!! after all your ‘god’ made us this way!

  24. -œYou can’t have it both ways and say these relationships are normal and need equal rights or benefits but then say it can only go so far. Our position is that, if you’re going to give them relationship registers, why not give them marriage?

    Now THERE is something we can all agree with!

  25. I can’t get over how dumb are the religious hate-mongers. The old “it’s not natural” line as a reason to hate? Well, it’s not natural to drive a car, or fly in a plane, or have a bad hairdo -as far as I know, no other species in nature does any of that – but no-one has held any of this “unnatural” behaviour against anyone. Fortunately it is not illegal to discriminate against anyone for being a stupid fool.

  26. I can’t get over how dumb are the religious hate-mongers. The old “it’s not natural” line as a reason to hate? Well, it’s not natural to drive a car, or fly in a plane, or have a bad hairdo -as far as I know, no other species in nature does any of that – but no-one has held any of this “unnatural” behaviour against anyone. Fortunately it is not illegal to discriminate against anyone for being a stupid prick.

  27. “It is right to discriminate against those things that are unnatural” – no it’s not… because same sex couplings have been recorded in over 450 species of animals in nature, including life long couplings, (including in species with larger brains than us such as Dolphins & Killer Whales).