Gay Arabs won’t march in parade
Queer Arab group Beit el Hob will not march in Saturday’s Mardi Gras parade.
Official suggestions for parade participants, under the theme Nations United, included dressing up as the national flag or other iconic imagery of countries they closely identify with, which Beit el Hob spokesman Nassim Arrage feared would be harmful to many from areas of conflict.
While we welcome the idea behind this year’s Mardi Gras theme, we’re really uncomfortable and concerned with the nationalistic agenda and overtones, he told Sydney Star Observer.
The use of flags in Australia is a highly political and contentious one. There’s this nationalism that is going on that doesn’t recognise that it’s actually alienating, or what celebrating nationality might mean to a queer Arab in the context of the world after 9/11 and anti-terrorism laws.
Beit el Hob raised its concerns with NMG, but had their requests for a pre-parade cultural sensitivity briefing rejected. For us as queer Arabs, that’s a dangerous area for us to go into, Arrage said.
We organise under the words -˜queer Arabs’ to avoid geopolitical issues, to try and bring our commonalities together rather than the things that would tear us apart.
The soundtrack for parody float Surry Hillsong will overlay the Islamic call to prayer with a Jewish spiritual song Avinu Malkeinu, alongside mixes featuring Dr Martin Luther King, gospel music, Hindu chants, Baptist preachings and Jedi.
Surry Hillsong organiser Ethel Yarwood said the float was intended to cause controversy.
NMG spokesman Damien Eames said they were disappointed Beit el Hob had decided not to participate this year, and rejected the idea the theme was potentially divisive.
This weekend you will see that there are is a huge variety of themes being expressed by parade entrants. Some fit clearly with Nations United. Some have nothing to do with it. It is ultimately up to parade entrants what they choose to do, he said.
Certainly from reading through descriptions of parade entrants there is a very positive emphasis on multiculturalism and diversity.
Live at sydney auburn love to meet good friends gays
hope to meet more friends here love u all guys
Overall, the Arab gay boys are generally very good-looking and very sexy – we need them just as we need everyone to participate, without prejudice.
There were plenty of Arab marchers anyway, in other floats- some with national flags, and some with none at all.
This Beit el Hob group have separated themselves & boycotted the parade when they could have clearly avoided having flags at all & attended. Definately not in the spirit, & not a good separatist corner they have backed themselves into with this action, when obviously many other Arab marchers did attend & had no problem.
The parade was a fantastic unifying success, with many Arab marchers in various floats, filling in the void by Beit el Hob.
Like I said- there was no need to have flags- they were not compulsory.
Maybe one way out of this mess for next year is for Beit el Hob to form a parade group similar to the “Asian Marching Boys”, with perhaps the “Arab Marching Boys”? It’s worth a try.
Shayne, Yehezkel Kaufman was a biblical scholar who was born way too late (1889, a mere seven years before Theodor Herzl’s ‘The Jewish State’ was published) to be one of the founders of Zionism. He would have been a child when the first Zionist congress was held in in the 1890s. If you mean he was around when the state of Israel was founded, then that’s a different statement. It doesn’t make him a founder of Zionism as a movement.
Also, I do know that Zionism and Judaism are not the same thing. As previously stated, I’m not a newcomer to this. I also know that some Torah-true Jews are opposed to Zionism and other Torah-true Jews (see the teachings of Rav Kook or observe that the IDF has a unit especially for haredim who choose to serve – they’re normally exempt) are enthusiastic Zionists.
Some Zionists, eg religious settlers in the West Bank, claim the land was given to them by God in the Torah, and other Zionists are religiously non-observant supporters of gay rights, for instance, who believe that the West Bank settlements need to be dismantled. And there’s a whole range in between. It’s much more complex than you paint it, as even a short visit to Israel will prove.
And … we’re right off the topic of this thread!
Rebecca , the quote, “It is essential that the sufferings of Jews. . . become worse. . . this will assist in realization of our plans. . . is from the diary of one of the founders of Zionism, Yehezkel Kaufman.
The point is that antisemitism suits the purposes of Zionism, (and modern Israel) very well. Critics of Israel’s atrocities against it’s neighbours are often called antisemitic, and the sufferings of the holocaust are invoked.
However, Zionism and Judaism are not the same thing. In its current form Zionism seeks domination of the Middle East, particularly Palestine, by means of violence. They claim this land was given to them by god in the Old Testament (Genesis 15:18).
Many Jews are totally opposed to Zionism and to Israel’s policies in the occupied territories of the West Bank. Zionism is actually antithetical to the spirit and teachings of the Torah.
Hey David, Yes, I’m very well aware of both the history of Zionism and of modern demographics. I was merely offering a working definition of Zionism, rather than a discussion of its history or of the many ideological tendencies that can be found inside the big Zionist tent. I also know that other people will use other definitions. I’m no newcomer to this one.
Rebecca, the idea of a Jewish state only emerged as a relevant political movement during a time of resurgent anti-semitism (late 19th to mid 20th centuries). Before that, Zionism was not a serious issue for Jewish people. Even today most Jewish people live outside Israel rather than in the so-called Jewish homeland – probably because they don’t like the idea of living in a walled-off ghetto.
Personally, I’d tone down ALL flag-waving. Nationalism of all varieties usually results in violence. That’s something I’d rather avoid.
“The tactic, of course, is to deliberately incite hatred of the Jew and then, in feigned horror, use it to justify the existence of the Zionist state. Antisemitism is the oxygen of the Zionist movement.” Absolute rubbish, Shayne Chester. It’s also offensive to suggest that Zionists “deliberately incite hatred of the Jew” – it’s tantamount to saying that Jews are responsible for antisemitism.
Do you also believe that gay people are responsible for homophobia?
Zionism is the legitimate movement of the Jewish people for a homeland in their historic lands. It is not about territorial imperialism. It’s about the Jewish people’s right to self-determination.
By the way, guess which Middle Eastern country has the best record on gay and lesbian rights in the region? Go on, guess – I’ll give you a clue – its flag has a blue Star of David on it.
Eli – if the group didn’t want to march with flags, they didn’t have to. That sounds like empathy and sensitivity to me. And if, say the Tamils objected to marching under the Sri Lankan flag, there was always the Aussie Flag…or no flag at all.
if any group had something to worry about, it was the one waving the Israeli flag after the reporting on Israeli military action in Gaza).
Finally, having “empathy and an open ear” does not mean one group can dictate the parade theme should be changed.
It sounds like a classic case of cultural insensitivity to me. People who don’t have the same experiences of marginalisation and discrimination belittle the concerns of others because they can’t relate to it. It seems confusing, subtle and overblown to people with the privilege of not being forced to have to think deeply about how Nationalism representation would affect them. That’s a natural but problematic reaction.
We need to have empathy and an open ear to the concerns of others, particularly people who are especially marginalised. We can’t assume that the way we see the world is a fair standard to judge the situations of others who have different experiences and opportunites. (Outside the box of our own perspectives).
-Eli
I think we need to be careful evoking the Holocaust, Alain Millett.
While I’m sure there is some value to Israel in assuming the sympathy for the persecution of Jews in the Holocaust, Zionism is something altogether different, it’s all about territorial imperialism. Indeed, if you read the gems of one of the Zionist founders, Yehezkel Kaufman, you’d see that the movement was quite antisemitic, (“It is essential that the sufferings of Jews. . . become worse. . . this will assist in realization of our plans. . .”) etc. The tactic, of course, is to deliberately incite hatred of the Jew and then, in feigned horror, use it to justify the existence of the Zionist state. Antisemitism is the oxygen of the Zionist movement.
I had a Jewish boyf for 20 years, my god daughter is Jewish. Torah-true Jews wish to live in peace and harmony, they deplore the acts of hatred and violence carried out by those who misuse the name of Israel and have substituted chauvinist nationalism for the values of the Torah. Zionist idealogy is totally contrary to traditional Jewish law and beliefs and the teachings of the Torah.
To exploit the suffering of Jews in the holocaust and evoke ‘antisemitism’ is just part of the way the Israeli propaganda works.
Shayne, you do a great job of listing all the issues in the Mid East, BUT you fail to mention the many missiles lobbed over the border into Isreal. Like much of the media we read in Australia its all anti Israeli. As a proud Zionist I can honestly say – THERE ARE FAULTS ON BOTH SIDES!!!!
While I can read between the lines and can agree to differ with you, can you please accurately report the truth.
The Mid East is an area of conflict, hatred and extremely complex issues. It is also a wonderful place full of vibrant peoples, vibrant customs and vibrant ways of life.
Due to the many many years of fighting, for some it is their entire lives. My Mother survived the Holocaust, saw active duty in the 1948 War of Independance, and has spent most of her 88 years fighting for her rights and the rights of the Jewish People. Whilst doing this she has seen, (and I have too), family and friends, loved ones killed in front of us.
With personal history like this, and the people on the other side have experienced the same issues, it is understandable that there is no simple solution.
I think the “Beit el Hob” group should have marched, after discussing the NMG an appropriate safe place for them in the march, and if necessary some security for there personal safety.
Beit el Hob’s lack of presence has meant the message of inclusivity was not sent out this year, the Arab community ,if they saw the parade or the Foxtel coverage – they would say – “look NO ARAB QUEERS”. The mullahs would be preaching about Mardi Gras calling it an abomination of the non muslim world.
We are everywhere and our sexual identity is our common link.
I have friends from every major religious belief and we live in harmony as we respect each others right to believe.
‘a minority of us have a problem with some nationalistic flags ‘? LOLZ. Now pay attention.
I said from the start that the history of conflict is incredibly complicated. But to look at what just one of those flags means to billions of people, in the 230 years since the Declaration of Independence, the US has invaded other countries on more than 200 occasions, an average of one foreign incursion every 14 months in the nation’s history.
Australia is the only country in the world that has fought alongside the Americans in every major war of the 20th and 21st centuries. When America goes to war, so do we.
So who do you think might take more offence than your sequinphobia at having to march wiuth trhe Stars and Stripes dude? Maybe one who’s loved ones were killed by US bombs in the last 20 years, the list of those countries bombed by the US in that time includes, Panama 1989, Iraq 1991, Kuwait 1991, Somalia 1993, Bosnia 1994, 1995, Sudan 1998, Afghanistan 1998 til the present, Yugoslavia 1999, Yemen 2002, Iraq 1991-2003, Iraq 2003-05, Afghanistan 2001-05, Iran, Pakistan, 2002-03. Countless millions of lives. How surprising then, that “a minority of us have a problem with some nationalistic flags.” :-(
Next we can talk about the 300 pages of war crimes attributed to Israel if you like.
Btw., I don’t celebrate Australia Day, I remember Invasion Day. But ya coulda guessed that, huh?
So Shayne, how to gay australian-arabs cope on Australia Day? It’s abit of a victim mentality to just say we won’t take part in it because we’ve got a minority of us have a problem with some nationalistic flags (because not all arabs “nations” have been “invaded” by the imperliast forces of the West).
and I agree, I too have a problem with that guy in the photo – waaa-aaay too much glitter! (See my point to Jodie above).
But good to see that you are not speaking for gay arabs.
John, I can’t speak for gay arabs. But I think if I had to march under, with, behind or before someone waving the flag of a nation who had committed such atrocities against my homeland, neighbours, family etc., I’d rather not. If I had to march next to this:
http://www.samesame.com.au/gallery/12565/photo/99832/Mardi-Gras-Parade-2009.htm
I think I’d buy some lamingtons and go home.
Ok – Parade has now been and gone – can anyone of the umpteen posters above TELL ME how many floats were nationalistic and flag waving … anyone ….. ???
Lets list a couple of the ones that weren’t
Taronga Zoo (not a sponsor, and employer)
Surry Hillsong (parody)
NSW Rural Fire
Lance Goward Tribute
Defence Force (not a uniform in sight to ensite national jingoism)
State Transit (they can’t even make Buses run on time)
Bingham Cup 2010 (rugby players!)
Lesbians on the Coast
Housing NSW
The Freemasons
Don’t feed the Bisexuals
United Bear TAles
Hot West (unless Penrith deglared soverign nation status before parade)
MCC
Sydney Atheists
I coudl go on, but I think that all of you get the drift …. no nationalism in these floats. I think they got their knickers in a knot because of Kabi and Surry Hillsong. They need to sit in a room full of mirrors and take a big long hard look at themselves …
J Foster – I’ve got a problem with the parade as well (i’m one person) – there is too much glitter – even Amnesty with their banned nooses were wearing glitter – how can we be taken seriously if all we ever do is glitter things up! – will I get a hearing from NMG??
Shayne, do you seriously believe that queer arabs would be afraid to march in the parade just because of other flags are being waved??? give them alittle bit more courage than that! Waving their own flags might be a different story, but seeing greek, chinese, brazilian flags being waved wouldn’t send them into panick mode.
And I would’ve thought that homophobia would’ve been much more prevalent than anti-middle eastern sentiment on a night like that. I saw plenty of homophobia after the parade all throughout the city. it makes me wonder whether the parade does any good in educating people about what the glbt community is really about (see my point to Jodie above).
The issue is not that most cultural groups accept the flag-waving aspect of the 2009 Mardi Gras theme but that one didn’t. I’m therefore very disappointed that NMG wasn’t more open and considerate. It’s the sort of response gay and lesbian and other sexual minorities get from straights continually.
merlot, the history of conflict in the middle east is incredibly complicated. You’re probably aware that we signed off on the coalition that slaughtered massive numbers of Iraqis and Afghanis, mostly innocent civilians. WE don’t do a body count of their side, but the Opinion Research Business survey estimted 1,033,000 violent deaths as a result of the conflict in Iraq alone. You may have heard of the Israeli attacks on Lebanon, – about 1000 civilians killed – but you may not have heard of the 100’s of 1000’s of cluster bombs that were dropped on that country just hours before the war ended, which still take the lives and limbs of mostly children. Nor may have you heard of the 300-page list compiled by the Red Cross, Amnesty etc of documented war crimes committed against the Palestinians, including burying children alive, dropping phosphorous to burn civilians alive, gunning down those trying to escape…and hundreds of other obscene acts.
So when Mr Arrage says, -œFor us as queer Arabs, that’s a dangerous area for us to go into, I can probably understand how they might find marching in a sea of flag waving a little intimidating, can’t you? But I do admit, with the quote taken out of context, as it is in the article, it’s a little difficult to speculate on that to which he was referring.
Whether or not Beit el Hob is marching this year, queer arabs will be marching in tonight’s parade. They will be part of the 130+ floats celebrating tonight.
The core message I want to get across is that I and others who make Beit El Hob happen, did not want to organise under the Beit El Hob banner this year. Some of us felt it was an unsafe environment for ourselves and potentially for other members of Beit El Hob.
I cannot speak for all queer arabs – what we have in common is that we are a queer, we come from an arabic-speaking background and we live in australia – in every other way we are a diverse group of people with differing opinions. This is a great thing.
Happy Mardi Gras to all. Mardi Gras was first and should always be a site of rebellion and protest as well as a time of celebration and being proud of ourselves as beautiful queer people.
Shayne, it’s not clear from the story who the “cultural sensitivity briefing” was for. Was it to meet with the organisers of NMG or was it to deliver a homily and lecture to each of the 136 floats.
HGD, you have nailed it on the head.
Lots of opinions, but as no one seems to understand what the issue is, I’d have thought the point was, “Beit el Hob raised its concerns with NMG, but had their requests for a pre-parade cultural sensitivity briefing rejected.” merlot.
Squeaky wheel gets the grease!
Quote from NMG “Some fit clearly with Nations United. Some have nothing to do with it. It is ultimately up to parade entrants what they choose to do.”
No one is forced to carry any flags. Most of these postings ignore that point.
After 30 posts I’m still not sure what Beit el Hob’s flag phobia has to do with being Arab. If they’re objecting to flags as generic symbols of a nationalism to which they have a standing politically-based aversion, fair enough, don’t wave them – was NMG insisting that they did? – but WTF has that got to do with being Arab?
Flags and banners are incredibly powerful symbols in the Arab world as anyone who stood in Martyrs Square in Beirut in the weeks after the assassination of Rafik Hariri in 2005 could testify. The square was a sea of Lebanese flags and the Cedar of Lebanon a powerful unifying symbol for Muslim, Christian and Druze.
I don’t buy the bullshit that the Australian flag is inherently oppressive and racist any more than I buy the bullshit that the actions of out of it, ignorant, bogan teenagers – whether their antecedents lie in the Shire or Lakemba – should be allowed to ultimately determine the way that flags are used in a celebration of gay culture.
NMG may be guilty of a tacky parade design choice (is it true that all the HIV floats are grouped under Africa – coz that’s where HIV is happening?) but it’s not guilty of fomenting Anglo-centric racism, not responsible for the Cronulla riots and not required to apologise to a bunch of over-sensitive posturers who are using ethnicity to make a point that is purely – and much more honestly – made as a political point. Happy Mardi Gras.